John Jay Papers
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Sarah Livingston Jay to William Livingston, 24 June 1781

Sarah Livingston Jay to William Livingston

Madrid 24th. June 1781.—

My dear Papa,

I had the pleasure of writing you a long letter by Mr: Toscan & likewise sending a duplicate of one which had been written a long while ago,1 I hope you will soon receive them as they may serve to shew you that those sentiments of gratitude & esteem to which you are intitled from me have not been obliterated by absence. The reluctance I feel to lessen the satisfaction of my dear Papa, already sufficiently involv’d in cares, has prevented me from disclosing a circumstance from which we have receiv’d not a little distress. I scarcely know where or in what manner to introduce a subject which I could wish buried in eternal silence: but since justice to ourselves as well as duty to you requires it I will undertake the painful task.

You know my dear sir in what manner the prospects both of your family & ^Mr. Jay’s^ in respect of wealth have been destroyed by this war; that both you & Mr. Jay had disregarded all private considerations & intirely devoted yourselves to the service of the public. In the midst of the career you was elected Governor, Mr. Jay was appointed Minister; neither of those offices impeded your public services but rather prepar’d a prospect of more extensive usefulness: they were accordingly accepted. You resign’d the repose which you had long ardently wish’d; Mr. Jay consider’d in what manner he might render his appointment beneficial to his friends as well as serviceable to his Country: education so necessary to render men useful to Society being interrupted, he concluded to take his nephew with him, that he might at the same time that he inspir’d him with patriotic sentiments ennable him to render future services to his Country. My brother had recd. his education it’s true, but Mr: Jay still thought Brockholst might derive advantages from making the voyage with us, for which purpose the consent of Congress & yourself was obtain’d, & Mr. Jay hoped that the pleasure you relinquish’d, by giving us his company would be compensated for by the advantages Brockholst would receive by residing some time in Europe; as I’ve often heard Mr. Jay say that here he might perfect himself in two useful languages, gain a knowledge of mankind, form useful connections, & at the same time make such a proficiency in the study of the Law as might ennable him with a little practice on our return to make himself master of it if Congress should not choose to place him in a political line. But alas! instead of an affectionate & chearful Brother we too soon discover’d a discontent & disgust which astonish’d us, my brother’s temper I always knew to be irritable to an unhappy excess; but I flatter’d myself that that generosity of disposition which I had remark’d with pleasure in our family, would secure us from impoliteness except at times when his passions were not under the influence of his reason & which I would readily have pardon’d: but I was mistaken, a constant captiousness and sulkiness has without ceasing mark’d his conduct, & I’m sure that if you had been a witness of the forbearance that Mr. Jay has impos’d upon himself even when most insolently treated by him, you would not have been less surpris’d at his moderation or less wounded by the want of delicacy in B—t than myself: To confess the truth, my feelings have been too much hurt always to admit concealment which has induc’d me two or three times to bring on an explanation, hoping that when he perceiv’d how much I was pain’d, he would endeavor to cultivate a more happy disposition— But Mr: Jay always disapprov’d those eclaircissements in the presence of B—t as ^well as^ when we were in private, telling me that his situation with respect to Brockholst was too delicate to admit of those remonstrances which friendship would justify & that he hop’d to conquer his disgusts by a repetition of good offices; but Mr. Jay was mistaken in his opinion of Brockholst, instead of being gain’d by gentleness the idea of his own importance rose with our condescension & he has ^twice or^ thrice threatned to return to America which Mr: Jay with uncommon meekness as often disuaded him from. When he return’d from France we resolv’d to continue the utmost caution, & even to avoid such subjects of conversation if possible as might excite his captiousness not omitting our endeavors to please him. Unfortunately the other day the Coll: & a young gentleman from France who had din’d with us, conversing on the manners of different Countries, the Coll: took occasion to be very severe on the Americans on the score of sobriety, adding that it was more rational to drink wine like the French with their dinner than to oblige their Guests to get drunk after, as was the custom in England and America: the gentleman who had been educated in England ask’d permission to assure him that that barbarous custom was at present abolish’d there, & I took the liberty of rescuing my countrymen from the same disgrace; however, the Coll: did not relinquish his assertion but was polite enough to believe that I thought as I spoke since the ladies were excus’d from that ceremony—the gentlemen smiled and inquir’d if Congress gave into that fashion— Congress! reply’d the Coll: I have seen them all drunk at a time. Coll: said I it may have happen’d that upon the celebration of our Independance or some other public festival those gentlemen have drank more freely than usual, but surely you would ^not^ infer from that, that it was a practice they were often guilty of. Oh Congress are like other men & the custom of getting drunk after dinner is general. Soon after the two young gentlemen retir’d; and I observ’d to Mr. Jay that my brother’s remarks upon Congress appear’d to me imprudent considering the Country we were in & that he himself was a servant of that Assembly, since such reflections might make deeper impressions than if dropt under other circumstances, he told me that his sentiments corresponded with mine upon that subject but that he fear’d to mention them lest he might provoke him, & that there was a probability the like conversation might not soon happen again. The next day I was amusing myself with drawing when the same gentleman came in to thank Mr. Jay for the permission he had obtain’d through him to reside at Toledo some time,2 adding that he should have fear’d to trouble him had he thought so much time & difficulty would have been necessary to acquire a permission that might be granted in a few hours, but these monarchical governments continued the gentleman choose sometimes to shew their power. Mr. Jay made the usual reply to the gentleman’s Compts: but the Coll: took up the reflection upon these kind of Governments & said that Congress exceeded them far, for that to his knowledge a person had been detain’d at Philadelphia three months to receive a passport from that Assembly after they had resolv’d to grant him one— Ay but says that gentleman they ought to be excus’d from the consideration of the multiplicity of business that demands their attention. Mr. Jay with his ordinary good-humor, said they should at least be spar’d the censure of Americans, & then as he had his hat in his hand when the gentleman ^came^ in, he recommended him to my attention & bid us good-morng.—

The Coll: was displeas’d with that observation, & after Mr. Jay withdrew, said that for his part he thought the Americans ought to speak their sentiments of Congress wth the utmost freedom, that ^they^ were like other men, & he doubted not but that there were among them as great rascals as in other assemblies, & that indeed he knew some. I said that in America no ill could arise from scrutinizing their conduct, but that here as the independance of America had not been publicly acknowledged, we should be careful not to lessen the respectability of the representatives of our Country: Some conversation pass’d on that subject in the course of which I could not forbear requesting that even if he differ’d from me in opinion on that matter he would spare my feelings in future whether they arose from prejudice or esteem, promising likewise that I would observe silence on any one topic that would be disagreeable to him. upon wh his warmth increas’d & he declar’d he was sorry to find me so deficient in good sense, then turning to the stranger ask’d him to go with him to Mr: Carmichael’s, he says the Coll: can abuse Congress tho’ formerly a member of it & thank God there we can say what we please.

When Mr. Jay return’d I mention’d to him what had pass’d, he told me he fear’d I had been angry, since he had sometimes observ’d that when my brother was unpolite I appear’d too sensible of it. In the evening B. return’d from Mr. Carmichael’s & after supper he told Mr. Jay that he had reflected on the conversation that had pass’d between Mrs. Jay & him & that he preferr’d going to America to remaining like a slave here. Mr. Jay endeavor’d to reason with him but that was in vain, & indeed some indecencies in B—’s conversation made me quite as angry as himself, which Mr. Jay perceiving, told us we were both too warm to be reasonable & advised the Coll: to go to bed & me to compose myself: I slept but little that night; the insinuation of slavery which the Coll: had dropt was an idea I could not account for as it was impossible to act with greater delicacy than Mr. Jay had observ’d towards him. From the time that Mr. Jay’s sallery commenced he allow’d the Coll: two hundred & fifty spanish dollars a year to furnish him with Clothes & pocketmoney; his washing & mending being done in the family, & even chose that the money should pass thro’ my hands to him to avoid giving rise to any disagreeable feelings that B—might be sensible of upon those occasions. As to any restrictions upon his pleasures, there have been none; few persons in Madrid are less acquainted with the manner in which he spends his time than we are; he is studious I believe but we are both unacquainted with his studies. Mr. Jay’s advice was never kindly taken by him, on the contrary Brockholst has not been sparing of his sarcasms on his brother for advising him to pay considerable attention to some particular books as preludes to the study of the Law: offering at the same time to send by the way of Holland for such Lawbooks as would have been necessary; but as B—t treated almost every thing recommended by Mr. Jay as unessential and frequently as ridiculous, that plan was not executed. Thus my dr. Papa have I day after day experienc’d mortifications that can only be imagin’d by those who have the welfare of a brother as much at heart as myself, who like me admire the tenderness & delicacy of a husband, & like me lament his endeavours for a brother’s happiness repaid with hatred. But think not sir I ascribe the whole of my brother’s conduct solely to the dictates of his own head or heart— No, there is another cause & one that has not given us less pain— Good God! papa so dearly as we love America! that all our unquiet should proceed from those who recd. their birth in that favor’d Country—my emotions are very great when I reflect upon the insidious & cruel manner in which Mr. Carmichael has treated Mr. Jay: the friendly part he had assum’d while we were at Philadelphia was thrown aside soon after the Confederacy was dismasted, & tho’ the masque has at times been reassum’d, the cloven foot was not concealed as formerly— With this gentleman the Coll: has form’d the strictest intimacy, swallowing unwarily his artful baits: I soon perciev’d the seeds of jealousy grow in the breast of Mr. Carmichael— He knew the reputation which you sustain’d in America & fear’d a rival in your son; he saw the strong attachment of Mr. Jay to the Coll: & likewise was sensible of his application & speedy attainment of the spanish language, he observ’d with pain that Mr. Jay was anxious for the advancement of my brother & employ’d him in copying for Congress which increas’d his jealousy so much lest Congress by that sd. be reminded of him, that he could not conceal it, but told Mr. Jay in my presence, that it had so odd an appearance that a Member of Congress had inquir’d of him in a letter, the reason why the papers were not in his hand-writing? but for his part he said he suppos’d it arose from Mr. Jay’s desire of making the Coll: acquainted with business and of promoting him.

A variety of circumstances too tedious to enumerate in a letter leave me not the smallest doubt that he has made B—t act a part so foreign to the welfare of himself & the interest of the family: I’ll only mention one instance by which you may judge of B—t’s devotion to him. Last summer Mr. Jay gave B—t a paper to copy, which not choosing Mr. C—l should be acquainted with, desired my brother, who had acted always as his private Secty. not to mention it to him, yet in a few days after he did, & Mr. C—l spoke to Mr. Jay about it & said he had it from the Coll:, Shortly after I myself heard Mr. Carmichael apologizing to the Coll: for mentioning it: upon which the Coll: reply’d Oh, it’s no matter, I’m glad of it such caution is all d—n nonsense. In short I’m well persuaded he has in the most artful manner endeavor’d all along to make Mr. Jay & the Coll: disatisfyed with each other,3 which tho’ Mr. Jay saw thro’ I’m not sure the Coll: did not: I remember last fall Mr. C—l happen’d to be present when the Coll: in one of his ill-humours threatned to return to America.— After B—t had withdrawn Mr. C—l said he was very sorry for what had pass’d. Mr. Jay said he was the more hurt by such conduct as he had a great affection for B—t. Upon which Mr. C—l reply’d that young folks would often abuse the affection their friends had for them, that he himself had done so when in Scotland with the Uncle that brought him up, but that when the Coll: grew older he would know better. Mr. Jay thought that an extraordinary manner of apologizing for the Coll: who you know sir is no child, but seeing that those observations were rather calculated to irritate than reconcile matters, determin’d to frustrate his unfriendly designs by behaving to B—t as if nothing had happen’d. Though I’m well convinc’d that Mr. C—l for a long time fear’d a future rival in Brockholst & took immense pains to infuse into his mind discontents against Mr. Jay in order to make the stay of both of them in this Country disagreeable to themselves, yet I begin to suspect that having accomplished his aim on the part of B—t & not only made him an enemy to his brother, but also persuaded him ^Brockholst^ to think that his own interest & his were united, he would rather the Coll: should stay here not only to trumpet him as is the present system but also to lessen & behave rudely to Mr. Jay which B—t very frequently does even at our own table before company & that in the most indecent & unprovok’d manner, which Mr. C—l is not ignorant of, having been present more than once upon those occasions. Had I been in Mr. Jay’s place I never could have observ’d such moderation & civility to that gentleman after being acquainted with his baseness as he has done—but if moderation & prudence are virtues, I’m sure has enough of them. The subjects I’ve been obliged to dwell so long upon are so interesting that I know not where to stop; I would avoid a single hard reflection on B—t that was not necessarily occasioned by the justice due to ourselves; but I value your good opinion too much to be willing to forfeit it when I know that I have not ceas’d to deserve it. If the Almighty answers our wishes for the safe arrival of B—t in America, my breast will be compos’d, & I will continue to trust in his providence to be one day delivered from the snares with which we are beset by a designing man. Indeed were I not bless’d with confidence in Heaven I never could have supported a chearful disposition at such a distance from friends whose value is enhanc’d by the dangers that surround them, seperated from my son, depriv’d of a lovely daughter, distress’d by a mistaken brother, & convinc’d too late of the insincerity of a person I believ’d our friend, when already in a foreign Country: yet there is a sweet consolation in innocence which soothes the mind under every perplexity & prevents the most disagreeable circumstances from destroying our peace. Should my brother attempt to excuse his return with plausible reasons, I wish they may be accepted, you cannot but see the disadvantage it would be to him should his conduct be scrutinized or exposed. I wish that when I write again to my dear papa a more agreeable subject may employ my pen; at present I’m sure we are both too much fatigued for you to read or me to write more than that I am with the greatest sincerity Your affectionate daughter

Sa: Jay

Governor Livingston

ALS, NNC (EJ: 12976). Marked: “Duplicate”. Addressed: “His Excellency Governor Livingston.” Endorsed by JJ. Further noted by JJ: “N.B. The Letter of which this is a Copy, was enclosed to Miss C. Livingston with an Injunction not to deliver it unless Brockholst’s misrepresentations to his Father should be such as in her opinion to render it absolutely necessary. N.B. it never was delivered to him—his confidence in him remaining undiminished.”

1No letter from SLJ to her father dated in late April or early May, when Jean Toscan left for America, has been found. The letter written “a long time ago” may be that of 14 Mar. 1781, NNC (EJ: 7349).

2The gentleman was probably John Vaughan. See JJ to BF, 31 May, above.

3For Carmichael’s impact on JJ’s household, see also SLJ to Catharine W. Livingston, 25 July 1781, below.

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